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  • Scripture is in Red
    Letter from Reader in Blue
    Search The Scripture Response in Black

    Recently I received this letter from one of our readers:

    "I read your piece on what you call UES. I am amazed at the interpretation you give. There is so much I could write about but let me share with you from my own life"

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    Because of the lack of biblical support for the doctrine of "Unconditional Eternal Security" I am continually confronted with having to correct doctrine with those forced to share from either life experiences, or hypothetical situations. If I were to go by my life experiences, when I was running from God, I would be TOTALLY DECEIVED. I myself was backsliden for three years, committing adultery, lying, stealing, and living like a drunkard. During this period I never felt as though the Lord had left me, but was I safe trusting the way I felt? To trust our discernment, especially in a state of rebellion, "which is as the sin of witchcraft" (1 Sam 15:23), is a foolish mistake. Totally opposite of how I felt, scripture told me there was no way God could let me into His Heaven, living the way I was (Eph 5:3-6), even though I had a salvation experience and was on fire for God for years, prior to turning my back on Him.

    The Bible says:

    (Prov 14:12 KJV) There is a way which seemeth right unto a man, but the end thereof are the ways of death.

    Scripture is the only way we should come to conclusions concerning whether or not the teaching we embrace is true, and not our personal experiences.

    letter continued:
    "I have been saved for many years. Some of those years early on I suffered some backsliding and I stopped fellowshipping because I felt I was unable to live the Christian life. I thought I had lost my salvation because I no longer had that blessed assurance that comes from serving God."

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    The Bible says:

    (1 John 3:20 KJV) For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.

    Isn't it amazing that we do have a sense of assurance when we are moving forward in Christ?

    (Rom 8:1 KJV) There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

    letter continued:
    "I went back to the world. However it was different. I never took the name of the Lord in vain And I never gloried in my sin. I was unable to partake in sin without conviction and I became really miserable. I knew I was living wrong and I did repent and went back to church; where else could I go?"

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    The Bible says:

    (Gal 5:16-17 KJV) This I say then, Walk in the Spirit, and ye shall not fulfil the lust of the flesh. {17} For the flesh lusteth against the Spirit, and the Spirit against the flesh: and these are contrary the one to the other: so that ye cannot do the things that ye would.

    There is a war going on in our members and daily we are required to put our flesh into subjection to His Spirit, which God has made available for us to do, by His grace.

    (Rom 8:13 KJV) For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.

    You had asked "where else could I go"? There was another place for you to go. You could have continued in your sin, but by the grace of God you did not.

    letter continued:
    I knew the Lord and the power of His Word. I learned He accepted me and my failings and He will never leave me or forsake me as He promised. My salvation is secure in Him. Your salvation is secure also.

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    He does not leave us, we leave Him as we have both shared in our letters. You are accepted, not in your failings, but in Christ. Christ is the only reason any of us are accepted before God. You could not have said it better, when you said, "My salvation is secure IN HIM". That is the only place your salvation is secure, (IN HIM). Apart from remaining in Him (through faith) your salvation is hopeless. You were saved by grace through faith and you are remaining saved by grace through faith, and without faith it is impossible to please God. He will never leave you but the Bible warns us that we can leave Him.

    (Heb 3:12-14 KJV) Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God. {13} But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. {14} For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;

    letter continued:
    "If I had never been saved and washed in His Blood I would never have repented or been drawn back the way I was. Once you are saved old things pass away and all things are new; can't go back to the old ways of the flesh and enjoy it anymore. There are some who profess a conversion and fall away, but were they ever born-again? Impossible to say, only God knows for sure."

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    This could very well be true, they might not have been saved but you yourself were saved and fell away. Those that believe in "Unconditional Eternal Security" use this argument all the time. The answer is always that they were never saved. The Bible makes no exceptions for this loophole but it does say that it is possible to be saved and to fall away.

    (Heb 10:26-29 KJV) For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, {27} But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. {28} He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: {29} Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

    (2 Pet 2:20-21 KJV) For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. {21} For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

    The Galatians, having begun in the Spirit, were attempting to be made perfect in the flesh. Here was a perfect example of Spirit filled believers that turned from "the Holy commandment delivered to them", only to trust in something other than the one thing that would make them acceptable before God, (which is Christ alone). Paul went as far as to say that if they continued, they would not have Christ's righteousness imputed to them, "Christ is become of no effect unto you" and that they, with their decision to make circumsision neccessary for salvation, had "fallen from grace".

    (Gal 5:3-4 KJV) For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. {4} Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

    letter continued:
    "If they were I doubt they can stay away indefinitely because there is no peace. I believe Esau was hated by God for selling his birthright like Judas Iscariot was also hated. Anyone who rejects Christ is committing the unforgiveable sin and will suffer the judgement reserved for the devil and his angels."

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    People do stay away all the time. In John chapter 6:66 (notice the # of the verse) the Bible says that there were disciples that believed in him that followed him no more (it could have just as well said they "stayed away indefinitely" as you say here). It takes nothing short of a miracle for them to come back. Maybe I am misunderstanding this part of your letter, but are you saying that a saved person can commit the unforgivable sin? If so then you do not believe in unconditional eternal security.

    letter continued:
    "Anyone not saved yet is condemned already because his father is Satan Jn 8:44. To an unsaved person the words of Christ are foolishness and not coherent or understandable. The church at Laodicea was a saved church. There may have been unsaved people in attendance but it was His church. Having said this I must hasten to add Jesus was disgusted with them. He said "Those whom I Love I rebuke and discipline. So be earnest and repent... Rev 3:19. The wrath of God which is on the ungodly and unsaved was not upon this church, but rather his rebuke or chastisement."

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    I beg to differ!

    (Rev 3:14-17 KJV) And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God; {15} I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. {16} So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth. {17} Because thou sayest, I am rich, and increased with goods, and have need of nothing; and knowest not that thou art wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked:

    They were in Him but they are being told they would be spit out because of their lukewarmness. The end of their state if they do not repent is wretched, and miserable, and poor, and blind, and naked. All references used throughout scripture to describe the state of a soul without Christ. Let us not stop there.

    And unto the angel of the church in Sardis write;

    (Rev 3:3 KJV) Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

    He does not come upon anyone like a thief except those that are going to be judged in the Day of the Lord, (God's wrath). There are only two verses in the Bible that use this analogy and they can be found in:

    (2 Pet 3:10 KJV) But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

    And also:

    (1 Th 5:2 KJV) For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.

    These passages make it clear that you do not want His coming to come upon you like a thief. It then describes those that are ready for His coming this way:

    (1 Th 5:4-6 KJV) But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. {5} Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness. {6} Therefore let us not sleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

    Unto the angel of the church of Ephesus write;

    (Rev 2:4-5 KJV) Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love. {5} Remember therefore from whence thou art fallen, and repent, and do the first works; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will remove thy candlestick out of his place, except thou repent.

    What does it mean to have your candlestick removed? The Bible explains what the candlestick means in the prior chapter.

    (Rev 1:20 KJV) The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.

    Unless Ephesus repented, they would have their candlestick removed. Not a good place to be.

    And to the angel of the church in Pergamos write;

    (Rev 2:16 KJV) Repent; or else I will come unto thee quickly, and will fight against them with the sword of my mouth.

    Again this reference (using the sword of His mouth) is only used to describe Gods Judgement, on the ungodly, in the Day of the Lord, (God's wrath).

    (Rev 19:15 KJV) And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

    (Rev 19:21 KJV) And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

    Again: unto the angel of the church in Sardis write;

    (Rev 3:5 KJV) He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels.

    Maybe you unintentionally overlooked the threat of this church being blotted out of the book of life, (which is two verses prior to the verse you quoted on chastisement) while focusing on God's comment of chastening those He loves. There is a big difference between chastising and being blotted out of the book of life or being fought against by God with the sword of his mouth. It is true that God does chastise those He loves but that in no way makes void the warnings to the churches that their salvation is at stake without repentance. If these churches do not repent (again conditional clauses) they become an enemy that God threatens not to merely chastise, but, if necessary, to fight with, which I think they might be a little overmatched. When looking at all seven letters, they are all conditional promises with conditional warnings to repent and to hold fast till He comes.

    letter continued:
    "A lot of the scripture you present as salvation threatening is not to be dismissed lightly but I believe we can suffer judgement in this life for our continuing hard-heartedness. In 1 Cor 5: the issue of immorality and even incest is dealt with by Paul. This was pretty terrible stuff from a believer gone bad, a willful sinner as you would say. Paul was going to hand him over to Satan so his sinfull nature might be destroyed yet his spirit saved on the day of the Lord."

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    My first question is "how can anyone confess that I have quoted scripture that is threatening to our salvation when at the same time they do not believe our salvation is eligible to be threatened"? Apart from this seeming contradiction, I am afraid you have mistakenly misquoted the verse in Corinthians:

    (1 Cor 5:5 KJV) To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

    Paul's description to "deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh" was so that this believer might have a chance to see his sin for what it was, which would make repentance essential. Repentance and a necessity for Jesus in the individual's life were what Paul was trying to bring about (which in this case he did) that his Spirit may (or might) be saved on the day of the Lord. It did not say, "yet his spirit was saved," it said "that the spirit may be saved".

    letter continued:
    "There are consequences for willfull sin."

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    I would say so, forgive me for using this verse again, but it applies:

    (Heb 10:26-29 KJV) For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins, {27} But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries. {28} He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses: {29} Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?

    letter continued:
    Our eternal destiny is safe because we have been translated from darkness to light.

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    Our eternal destiny is in Christ and (in Christ) is the only place that we are safe. We have not become self-sufficient by a gift that is seperate and apart from Him. It is only in Him (and remaining in Him) that we have the gift of eternal life. We have to remain in Him (through faith) to have this promise. He is the promise. Continuing in Him is the condition of being a benefactor of His promises. Jesus said in

    (John 15:1-9 KJV) I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman. {2} Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit. {3} Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. {4} Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me. {5} I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. {6} If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned. {7} If ye abide in me, and my words abide in you, ye shall ask what ye will, and it shall be done unto you. {8} Herein is my Father glorified, that ye bear much fruit; so shall ye be my disciples. {9} As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.

    Paul gave us the same warning of continuing in Christ in order that we might remain reconciled, holy, unblameable, and unreproveable in His sight:

    (Col 1:21-23 KJV) And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled {22} In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight: {23} If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;

    letter continued:
    "His yoke is easy and His burden light. Wondering if we are in danger of being separated from His Love is not from Him."

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    It is if you are doing things that will separate you from Him such as:

    (Eph 5:3-12 KJV) But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; {4} Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks. {5} For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. {6} Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience. {7} Be not ye therefore partakers with them. {8} For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light: {9} (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth;) {10} Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord. {11} And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them. {12} For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.

    letter continued:
    How much sin is necessary to lose one's salvation?? If we really blow it bigtime and die are we still going to heaven?

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    It is not how much but if we continue to willfully practice it. The only way that one would think that one could blow it big-time (which I am assuming means to continue to sin like the devil) and still go to Heaven is if they are being taught that you can not lose your salvation even if you do. This doctrine is only necessary for those that do not want to forsake their lives and continue to remain in Christ through faith. If your choice is to remain in Jesus through faith this doctrine becomes unnecessary. Does one want to take a chance at blowing it big-time and trust in this doctrine hoping to still get to Heaven? I know you can count me out.

    letter continued:
    Or was the bad sin outweighed by all the good years of service to God?? The answer is our service to God is a way of glorifying Him and it pleases Him which is our reasonable service. It has nothing to do with earning salvation which is a gift afterall. "I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes Him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life... a time is coming when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live. Jn:5:24 I still enjoy your website! I am subscribing to your newsletter

    God Bless you

    Search The Scriptures Response:
    This is not about how we are saved but if salvation, once received, is conditional. The verse that you quote here "within itself" is conditional. It only applies to those that "hear his words and believes the One who sent Him". Do you think this is a one time believing and then ceasing to believe any more? Or is this a believing to the saving of the soul as is stated in:

    (Heb 10:38-39 KJV) Now the just shall live by faith: but if any man draw back, my soul shall have no pleasure in him. {39} But we are not of them who draw back unto perdition; but of them that believe to the saving of the soul.

    Am I a bad person to teach that "those who believe that no matter what they do, they cannot fall from grace" are wrong and need to continue in Christ through faith? I believe the bad person is the one that is teaching that once you are saved you are always saved and that, taken to its end result means, that you do not even need to continue in Christ, you have become self sufficiently heaven bound once you are saved. This cannot be supported whatsoever in scripture.

    If Once Saved Always Saved is True {Unconditional Eternal Security}

    1. How could one be blotted out of the book of life? (Rev 3:5, Rev 22:19)
    2. How could those that are sanctified by the blood of the covenant be warned if they continue to sin willfully there awaits for them a fearful judgment and a fiery indignation. (Heb 10:26-29)
    3. How could Paul say to the Galatians believers "who has bewitched you…Christ profits you nothing you have fallen from grace?" (Gal 5:4)
    4. How could it be better for those that, "have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, and are again entangled therein", to not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them. (2 Peter 2:20-21)
    5. How could Paul threaten the Corinthians that when one "eateth and drinketh unworthily" one "eateth and drinketh damnation {or Hell} to himself, not discerning the Lord's body"? (1 Cor 11:29)
    6. How could the Hebrews be warned: Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God"? (Heb 3:12)
    7. How could one quench the spirit (1 Thes 5:19)
    8. How could one have no "inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God" if they return again to the world and continue after being saved to practice certain sins? (Eph 5:3-12)
    9. How could the church of Ephesus have their candlestick removed? (Rev 2:4-5)
    10. How could God fight the church of Pergamos with the sword that comes from his mouth? (Rev 2:16)
    11. How could Paul tell those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost, And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come, that it was impossible for them, If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame?

    One has to twist practically the whole Bible to make this doctrine unscathed by all the scripture that come's against it. If once saved always saved were true why doesn't the Bible just plainly say you cannot fall from grace? Because it only exists in the minds and hearts of those who continue to trust in it to get them to Heaven, instead of continuing to trust in Christ, which is the only way to Heaven.

    I am glad you enjoy the website and I hope this hard response does not discourage you from reading the other newsletters that God has laid on my heart.

    God Bless you!

    Search The Scriptures

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